General Category => General Helio Discussion => Topic started by: Doug Johnson on July 05, 2015, 11:11:31 AM

Title: c/n 2, N8745R
Post by: Doug Johnson on July 05, 2015, 11:11:31 AM
6 pictures check your albums. Please do an internet search maybe you'll come up with one I couldn't find, I need all the help I can get.

Previous posts about VT-DVC  or anything click on    [  Enter ?

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c/n 2, prototype built at Canton Airport 01/62, as prototype H-500 Twin for civilian market original registry N8745R H-500 Prototype no. 2 built with two 250 hp Lyc O-540-B2B placed in experimental category for flight test leading to certification given type certificate A2EA 07/63, sold 08/63 as model U-5 s/n AF-2 to King-Hurley Research Group (CIA front co) DC, 01/64 placed in experimental category *install Lyc IO-540-C2C and Rajay/Riley turbochargers STC and convert to U-5B configuration 04/64* install oxygen system, place on Fluidyne hyd wheel-skis until 04/65, Aviation sales & Engineering Assoc MD until 09/65, Marathon Aviation corp (CIA front co) FL install 90 gal ferry tank in middle seat position with 81.8 gal usable 62.1 allowable and removable 52 gal wing tip tank, 10/65 Issued ferry permit export to Thailand ferry from Norwood MA Northeast US border ?, reg cancelled as dismantled 05/66, 02/67 reg VT-DVC India, operated in cooperation with Govt India Aviation Research Center (ARC) Charbatia Air Base, on Tibet border and probablyin Tibet. fate unknown reportedly all were destroyed except 1 but none have survived until present

As always any further information or pictures would be greatly appreciated.

photos below taken in Sharjah a United Arab Emirates city on the Arabian Gulf.
Note below that this a/c has been converted to U-5B

1st article

2nd article
Title: Re: c/n 2, N8745R
Post by: Louis on July 05, 2015, 05:52:35 PM
A lot of window surface.  I like that

Title: Re: c/n 2, N8745R
Post by: Louis on July 05, 2015, 07:42:25 PM'un_Chinois_en_Chine
Title: Re: c/n 2, N8745R
Post by: Doug Johnson on January 19, 2016, 10:47:28 AM
added mag article and three view drawing
Title: .
Post by: Doug Johnson on January 19, 2016, 10:48:56 AM
Title: Re: c/n 2, N8745R
Post by: Doug Johnson 1 on January 05, 2019, 11:23:58 AM
Couple more of Dr, Leekers photos of Twin Helio c/n 2 as N8745R also taken in Sharjah a United Arab Emirates city on the Arabian Gulf.

photos open at bottom of photo queue above
Title: Re: c/n 2, N8745R
Post by: tailhook on January 05, 2019, 01:46:44 PM
Clearly shown in this promo photo from the brochure airplane in 1965 when Helio Aircraft Corp. had its headquarters in Bedford, MA @ Hanscom Field. The idea of counter-rotating the props would have been advantageous in this respect to even greater single-engine control at low speed, also is evident the fixed airfoil between engine nacelles to alleviate airflow disturbance.

Title: Re: c/n 2, N8745R
Post by: Doug Johnson 1 on January 05, 2019, 04:20:03 PM
this photo is H-6 as N10036

I had previously resized and opened this picture at the top of the page at this previous post

click here
Title: Re: c/n 2, N8745R
Post by: Doug Johnson on October 12, 2021, 02:30:19 PM
edited the history file a bit corrected some formatting errors.

I also found a bit more about the ferry flt from ferry from Norwood MA at the malta site.

It shows the Edward Cunningham as pilot on this Twin Helio and 2 of the other twin Helios and Twin Helio 2 and 5  are the 2nd and 3rd to refuel at Malta on 27-28/10/'65 Helio twin 3 refueled the day before.

It shows from Boston, Torbay, Santa Maria, Valencia to/Beirut which is kind of a confusing route to take to get to Malta then another 4000 miles to Thailand or even the final destination of Charbatia air base in eastern India which is 2700 miles or am I missing something here.

The Atlantic crossing route on all of the 5 twin helios, is Torbay to Santa Maria the shorter southern route, with 2500 mile range, turbocharged twin engines and equipped with oxygen to flyover most weather it seems to be the logical route.

edited; using BW's info
Torbay (Newfoundland near St Johns)
Santa Maria (island in the Azores, close to San MIguel) ‚Äč
Valencia (Spain)
Luqa, (Malta)
Beirut, (Lebanon)

see JaimesCard post below
Title: Re: c/n 2, N8745R
Post by: Louis on October 12, 2021, 07:20:29 PM
Incredible documents !!

Title: Re: c/n 2, N8745R
Post by: JamesCaird on October 12, 2021, 09:00:59 PM
Not sure it is really important, Stephen, but the Helio Twins were put together at Canton Airport (Massachusetts) I saw them there.  Administration was moving to Bedford/Hanscom Field but Canton was still an active shop.  Canton airport was only about a mile from Norwood airport and some confusion exists because Helio had a sales office at Norwood airport and received mail there.  The air to air photos are likely the terrain around Canton in winter and the one with the houses in the background is very likely at Canton.  The airport was 3 grass runways sort of in a bowl , a river valley.  I spent many a Saturday there with my father.  The original Helioplane was hanging from the roof of the hangar inside.  Cheers/  BW
Title: Re: c/n 2, N8745R
Post by: Doug Johnson on October 13, 2021, 12:45:28 AM
Not quite sure why are referring to Stephen.

Also there seems to some CIA created confusion and not quite sure why we are talking about Caton (but it is interesting are you thinking I need to edit the 'History paragraph?') when discussing ferry info this is what the ferry permit says;
Ferry Permit, from Norwood-Municipal Airport, Massachusetts via East Boston-Logan Airport, Massachusetts to U.S. Border, for export, at a Gross Weight not exceeding 5,850lb, which is 30% over the Maximum Certificated Gross Weight of 4,500lb.

The a/c was required to operate in the restricted airworthiness category 8, when tip tanks were installed and it was placarded 'tip tanks must be removed to place in standard airworthiness category 3'.

And aircraft modified, with installation of a temporary ferry fuel system of 90 gallons 81.8 gallons usable, in addition to the Wing Tanks (120 gallons), Tip Tanks (104 gallons) and Nose Tank (30 gallons usable) previously installed

that gave a range of around 2500 miles

But the info about the original Helioplane hanging in the Canton Hanger is kind of interesting I'll try to to add that to my info on the Helioplane. I have a picture of it at near Oshkosh EAA at 'Bill Weasner Welding' shortly before it was sent to the Smithsonian. My understanding was that it was sent there to make it flyable by removing the flaperons and putting the Friese style ailerons and interceptors on it.

Title: Re: c/n 2, N8745R
Post by: JamesCaird on October 13, 2021, 07:37:24 AM
Hi Doug-  I refer to "Stephan"  above because he had posted the mention of Bedford with regard to the Helio Twins up above here as Tailhook/Stephen.

 Interesting about the HelioPlane and Bill Weasner welding?  Bill Weasner was the owner/operator at Twin Pines airport near Princeton, NJ.  He had at least 3 Helios and a bunch of stuff he had found at auction (I assume).  All three Helios seemed to be under repair at some stage- gear leg damage mostly.   The town took over his field for a soccer pitch and all the stuff was moved to his Pennington property and scattered around.  The woods grew up and part of the barn collapsed but it is where I recovered most of 3 fuselages , wings, tails, cowling and various parts from a few years ago.  Bill Weasner was gone West by then but I got  some stories from his son.  Apparently an interesting character with some aeronautical background and certainly messed about with airplanes. Cheers/  BW
Title: Re: c/n 2, N8745R
Post by: JamesCaird on October 13, 2021, 08:00:42 AM
Hi again, Doug-  For questions about the ferry route for the Helio Twins:

 Torbay is Newfoundland near St Johns.  Santa Maria is island in the Azores up close to San MIguel (which is now the major airport) Valencia, Malta, Bierut all are fine.  Seems like there must have been another stop somewhere between Beirut and India. For Thailand in those days the big Helio/CIA/ Etc operational base was Udorn (Udorn Thani) which is in the north of Thailand about 30 miles (maybe) from Vientiene, Laos.  Back to North India not too far back across Burma and Bangladesh.  I have been to most of those SE Asia (and India- Bangladesh)places for one reason or another, that is why I was chasing Helios there.

 They departed from Norwood, Mass. (rather than Canton one mile away)  because that was where the fuel, paved runways and the paperwork were located. Cheers/  BW 
Title: Re: c/n 2, N8745R
Post by: Doug Johnson on October 13, 2021, 05:41:26 PM
I found the picture of the Helioplane at EAA and for some reason I thought Bill weasoner welding was near Oshkosh, WI which never made a lot of sense to take the a/c all the way to Wisconsin. Princeton NJ is more reasonable but it makes me wonder why they would fly the Helioplane 350 miles to farm out the modifications to Bill Weasoner welding, when they had there own shop and Princeton is further south of New York and the Smithsonian. But  after looking at all my photos of the Helioplane they all seem to have the split rudder and full span flaperons, but the picture of the Helioplane hanging in the smithsonian clearly has the Frise ailerons and 3/4 span flaps. So based on the photographs and the EAA info I decided to edit my history paragraph to show the modifications after it was certified instead of before. see my edit below

1st Helio, Model HC-1 ''Helioplane'', a two place proof of concept prototype, registry assigned N9390H a highly modified Piper PA-17 Vagabond with 85hp Continental (C85-12J) with belt reduction drive and 108'' Aeromatic prop, an  experimental airworthiness certificate with no restriction was issued 06/50, authorization to build up to 12 more under X category for demo purposes given, after hanging in the Canton Airport hanger for several years, The Helioplane was sent to Bill Weasoners welding at Twin Pines airport (now closed) near Princeton NJ for modification from full span flaperons, and split tail to 3/4 span flaps and wide chord Frise ailerons shortly after that it was permanently retired from service dereg 10/55, preserved at Smithsonian NAS Museum

I wish you had your camera with you back then when visiting the Canton airport what was it back then a Kodak instamatic or something like that, you took snapshots back then I think I remember. A picture of it hanging in the Canton Hanger would be helpful for this conversation.

I think I will go back an edit my ferry route using your information it makes the route given in the Malta flight plan make a lot more sense. I can copy it then and post it 4 more times with the individual posts of the other 4 Helios that leave flt plans at Malta.

I just happened to realize something else that I should have noticed before. I was told by someone (I forget who) that worked at Canton that one day they came to work and all the Twins and the spare parts were gone.
But ferry dates show #5 leaving 10/65, #3 leaving 11/65, #1 and #7 leaving in 04/66, then #2 and #6 leaving 02/67 then #4 in 6/67.

Interestingly 2, 3 and 5 refuel at Malta at nearly the same time, #3 and #5 seem to have spent a considerable amount of time one of the stops along the way.

They obviously didn't all leave overnight, I guess it was an airplane story CIA Helio stories seem to be the most imaginative. I get a few of those stories but surprisingly not as many as I you would think, I usually just make a correction without saying anything or change it to reportedly or possibly. The only problem with reportedly or possibly is that usually the next  time its repeated those words seem to get dropped.